Thread: Looking for Mary SMITH!

In 1851 William Thomas, 46, born Hereford (Ross?) and his wife, Mary, 27, born Salop (Shiffnal?), were living in Llangattock with their children George,4, and Priscilla, 1. In 1861 and 1871 Mary is shown as a widow, born Blackrod, Lancs.

The birth certificate of Presilla (sic) records her mother's maiden name as Mary Smith.

The only William Thomas/Mary Smith marriage I can find within a reasonable time frame took place in Glasbury, Brecon and Radnor, on April 5, 1847. This shows William as son of Richard Thomas, labourer and Mary as daughter of Charles Smith, potter. Both bride and groom were living locally at the time. Witnesses were Thos Powell, Thomas Smart, Margaret Waugh and R J Larkin.

I have found a possible entry for William in 1841 as a man servant, aged 35, living Hill Cott, Walford, near Ross, but without any other matching detail this has to remain rather speculative. Given his age I would not expect him to still be living with his parents. Family Search has a William Thomas baptised at Leominster, Herefordshire on 14 April 1805, son of Richard and Ann, but that is probably entirely coincidental.

Working from her age as shown on subsequent censuses, Mary was born between 1824-1827 and might well still have been at home in 1841, but where?

I would appreciate any help in unravelling Mary's identity. Is there anyone out there up to the challenge?

Hi brentor boy,
I'm looking but not having much luck. Looking for a Mary Smith born about 1824 in Shifnal Shropshire. Have not yet found any on-line records for one that fits.I know she said birth was Lancashire in later censuses but thought it best to start with Shifnal.

I have found two Mary Smith's born in Shiffnall Salop
1841 Census
Daniel Smith 60. Farmer
Ann Smith 45
George 20
William 15
Mary Smith. 16.
Sarah. 12.

!841.
John Smith. 45. Farmer
Mary 45
Mary 16
Jane 15

I will try to see if marriage may have taken place in Shropshire. Would you know which
Mary is the correct one?

Lola - thanks for your time and expertise.
Bronson - I know nothing more of Mary than in my original post. I am as certain of the census records as one can be. I am fairly confident that the birth certificate refers to my Mary but I have an open mind about the marriage.

Does the Birth Certificate mention Mother or Father's names if so we would be able to go further
even with one Name .

Bronson, I see that in my original post that, whilst I stated that the birth certificate gave Priscilla's mother's maiden name as Mary Smith, I did not confirm that her father's name was shown as William Thomas. Sorry. This is what lead me to the possible marriage in 1847.

Okay Brentorboy. I will look on more records.

Hello again. I have been going through the Census. I have found Pricilla. on 1851 with the Family as you did.
Did you notice that a Ebenezer Davies was a Lodger. George was 3.
Then I found George 1861. Same Birth Date and Place. But listed as Step Son. To a Thomas Davis
Plus Elizabeth Thomas. aged 5 Stepdaughter. Born same place as George.
Mary was stated as born in wales. Then there is Elinor Davies 11 Daughter
and Thomas Davies one year. Son. There is no mention of Prisilla. I have scrolled through 1861.1871. and can not find her.

Have you considered that Mary became a Widow in 1850's. Not surprising as William was a Miner. George was a coal minor
at 13yrs. I can not connect that the Mary you found was stated as born in Lancashire I did find it myself
The transcribers do make mistakes but not that bad. I am looking to see if I can find them on the 1871 and 1881

Thanks, Bronson, for your further observations. To find Priscilla, it is necessary to be very imaginative in the spelling of her name! I will give you what I have unearthed and see if you can pick holes in it. Unfortunately I do not have direct access to census records so cannot provide references.

My person of direct interest is George. When he married Jane Smith in 1867 his father was recorded as William Thomas, deceased, and a witness was Jenkin Richards. Priscilla Thomas married Jenkin Richards in 1869 and 1871 "Precilia" and Jenkin are living in Pantywaun, Brithdir. Included in the household is "widowed wife's mother" Mary Thomas, born Blackrod, and her further children, Joseph and Mary.

In 1861 Mary Thomas, widow, born Blackrod, was living with children George, "Prescilia", Joseph and Mary at Pantywaun, Brithdir.

Mary Thomas was still with Priscilla and Jenkin in Pantywaun in 1881.

As far as I can see, there were only two "Priscilla" Thomas born in Wales in the period 1849/50 - one in Newcastle Emlyn district the other in Crickhowell. It is this latter one whose birth certificate I have, the details of which are approximately consistent with all other records I have. The Newcastle Emlyn birth is a little early and matches nothing geographically.

I have tries to establish whether George's wife, Jane Smith, and his mother, formerly Mary Smith, might be related but can find no link.

Assuming that the references I have found all relate to the same Mary and assuming that she did actually marry William, both or either of which assumptions could prove false, I wonder if the following might be an explanation for the variations in her recorded place of birth.

I am inclined to think that Blackrod, as given by Mary in 1861/1871, when she was head of household, to be the best indicator of her origins. It is possible that she, either alone or with her family, moved from Blackrod to Shifnal at some time before she met William so that he knew her as coming from Shifnal which, in 1851, he assumed to be her birth place.

By 1881 Mary and her daughter Priscilla had been living in the hamlet of Pantywaun, which was in the Gelligaer area, for over 20 years. When supplying information for the census Jenkin Richard, as head of household, carelessly and inaccurately declared Gelligaer as the place of birth of both his wife and mother-in-law.

All this is totally speculative, but it is there, in 1841, any Mary Smith, aged 14-17, living in Shifnal but born out of county, that might merit consideration? I really am grasping at straws. Thanks in anticipation.