Thread: Eliza Cates b: 1875 Marylebone London

My husband's Grandmother was Eliza Skinner ne`e Cates, but we only found this out after his mother died 1992 and I started researching his family. Eliza was called Dolly on the 1891 census
Eliza married William Skinner 1897 Marylebone and had a son William december the same year, on his baptism she is named as Dorothy she then had a son charles birth not found.
In 1909 her husband had a daughter witha another woman and then my mother in-law Alice Dorothy Skinner in 1912 with Eliza, at this time they were living in Forest Gate London E7.
Her Husband William was killed in September 1916 and her Son William killed October 1918.
From about this time the other woman took over the family and brought her daughter to live with them, she and my mother in-law were so much alike they could have been twins, my ma in-law told me many years ago she was 6 years old when she found out she had a sister so that would be about 1918, this other lady's name was Elizabeth Hayes, but she was known as Elizabeth Skinner, my husband and his brothers always beleived SHE was thier real grand mother, but she was not.
What I can't find out is what happened to the real Eliza Skinner, it looks like she went or died when her eldest son died 1918, but I can find no trace of her.

I would be very grateful if someone could help me find her.
thanking you Drinda

PS: Fanny Hayes the sister of Elizabeth Hayes was a witness at the wedding of Eliza & William.

have you ruled out these 2 deaths/ burials

Eliizabeth SkinnerRecord Typeeath Estimated Death Date:16 Feb 1918 Parish or Poor Law Union:St PancrasBorough:CamdenCounty:London

E SkinnerRecord Type:BurialEstimated Death Date:abt 1919Burial Date:8 Dec 1919Parish or Poor Law Union:St PancrasBorough:CamdenCounty:London

do you have them on 1901 census - i cant see them and when approx was charles born?

a poss birth for charles

Name:Charles SkinnerYear of Registration:1901Quarter of Registration:Jan-Feb-MarDistrict:Marylebone (1837-1901)County:London, MiddlesexVolume:1aPage:530

Hi Welshlady, First of all thank you for looking at this for me.
No I have not found William & Eliza on the 1901 census, but Eliza is named as Dolly on the 1891 census living at home with her father Henry. mother mother Hannah and Fanny Hayes who was a witness at Eliza's wedding, they were living at 3 Highworth St Marylebone.
As for Eliza's death I have looked at every Eliza Skinner from the beginning of 1918, but the ages do not match up, she lived in Forest Gate East London and if she died there it would have been registered at West Ham, I have been to all the local cemeteries and written to the mental homes, but still not found her, on her son Willam's Baptism she is called Dorothy so I have sereched the death records for Dorothy Skinner.
William was 39 when he died in WW1 1916
As for thier son Charles there are so many Charles Skinner's about that time both at Marylebone and West Ham it is hard to pin pont which one is the right one, I am still trying to find his baptism, that will help.
If anyone has any ideas I would be very grateful.
Thanks again Drinda.

i ahve had a good look round but cant find them on the 1901 census or find charles birth or baptism. williams is here and would have expected charles to be too.

Name:William Henry SkinnerRecord Type:BaptismEstimated Birth Date:abt 1897Baptism Date:13 Oct 1897Father's name:William SkinnerMother's nameorothy SkinnerParish or Poor Law Union:St MaryleboneBorough:Westminster

Eliza's birth registration 1875 her baptism 1890 and her marriage certificate only names her as ELIZA, But on the 1891 census she is Dolly and young Williams baptism she is Dorothy so I have searched for her under all three names without joy.
When her husband was killed 1916 and young Wm 1918 the war office sent a letter and scroll etc to Mrs ELIZA Skinner, I have written to the local mental home to see if she was admitted after her loss, but they have no record of her.

Although she married and had Young Wm at St Marylebone it is possible that Charles could have been born in Essex registered West Ham.
I know that they lived in Vansittart Rd Forest Gate when my mother in-law was born and sometime later moved just a few streets away to Wellington Rd Forest Gate, Charles married West Ham 1927.

William's illegitimate daughter was born Westminster 1909 it was her mother that moved into the family home in Wellington Rd and took over the family about 1918, my brother in-laws were born 1931,1936 and my husband 1934 and they all thought this lady was thier real grandmother and they loved as such.

This lady's real name was Elizabeth Hayes and the Fanny Hayes living with the Cates family in 1891 was her sisister.

Thanking you Drinda

Hello

Have you explored the HAYES / CATES family relationship?

1) SKINNER + CATES witneses Richard REEVES and his wife Fanny REEVES

2) REEVES = HAYES Fanny, witneses EKATES & C REEVES

elsabels

Yes I know about the Hayes-Reeves and was in contact with Fanny's daughter Blanche but have not heared from her for some time, if she is still alive she would be a hundred +.
Blanche did tell us to ring her brother because he remembers a lot more than her, he said he had a lot of family stuff in the loft and give him a few day's and he will sort it out, when my husband rang back his son answered the phone and was very rude, he said it was none of our buisiness and if we want to know anything to go and look it up.

I know that as well as Elizabeth Hayes having a Ilegitamate daughter with William Skinner There was another family scandal.
Thanking you Drinda.