Thread: Lost in France. Who was Arnold's mummy?

Hello everybody



I need an academic in medieval history.



Did St Bertha of Kent ever marry Ausbert Senator of the Moselle and bear Arnoldus c550-601????????

Some say she did, others don't.

What is certain is that she was the dau of the King of France and married

Aethelred King of Kent (not the Unready).

Was this a second marriage after Ausbert passed over?

According to "Hello" it is said that she wowed Aethelred in Paris as a young girl, so that would seem doubtful.



There is also a rumour that Ausbert married Blithildis Princess of Sessions and fathered Arnoldus by her.

I tend to prefer this because Bertha would have been busy doing saintly things and bearing future Kings of Kent.



Having said that, saints were ten a penny at that time!!



Sometimes there is too much info on the net!!



Any views would be gratefully received.



Best wishes to all

Mark

Hello Mark,



I'm no medieval history expert but I have a book "British Monarchs" by Mike Ashley which states that Athelbert the 1st married Bertha, daughter of Charibert, King of Paris c578. Bertha was born probably 560 and died after 601. Athelbert and Bertha had a son Eadbald who was born probably c582.



Athelbert married his second wife, name unknown and they had a daughter Athelburh who married Edwin of Northumbria c625.



Eadbald (son of Athelbert & Bertha) first married his father's widow (name unknown, his step mother) and his second marriage to Ymme or Emma of the Frankish royal household.



I had a look on the internet as well and on one site they had Eadbald marrying his mother Bertha!!!



Think I'll go for a lie down now



Oops, forgot to say, don't know who Arnold's mommy is.



Notebook

Thank you Notebook.



Hope you have recovered from your attack of the vapours from reading such racy stuff!! The Oedipus Complex, patricde, power, land, matricide, every other -cide......real News of the World fodder!!



Still no further forward but you confirm what I believe regarding the Garden of England's finest!!

The devastatingly beaufiful Bertha (she'll do for me, saint or no saint!! See paparazzi photo at http://www.earlybritishkingdoms.com/...os/bertha.html ) was daughter of Charibert and the gentle Ingeborg, when the football hooligan from Canterbury was partying in the Champs Elysee and fell for her charms. (Aaaah!! Bit like Peter Andre and Jordan!!)

She became a WAG, and once the ring was on her finger, changed him to her ways, and pretty much made HIM a saint, stopping his lager swilling etc and converting him to Catholicism.



None of the following and numerous others give any mention of her being a widow or being involved with Ausbert. (Oh for 6th century censuses and FreeBMD!!)

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cathol..._(1913)/Bertha

http://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=1767

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02519a.htm



The LDS and it adherrants have got conflicting views, sometimes linking Bertha and Blithildis as the same person married to Ausbert, and sometimes as separate wives of Ausbert.

This one is a gem, which covers all bases even having her marrying her son.

http://www.geni.com/last-name/Queen%20of%20Kent



Bertha is supposed to have been born 541 and died 580 or 565-612 or 523-580, perm any two from seventeen!!

Arnoldus was born c1550 and was murdered in Tunisia in 601.

So she had her son at aged nine aged twenty six or fifteen years before she was born!!

The only half convincing one where it states she marries both Ausbert and Aethelbert is http://www.geneal.net/2197.htm



Personally, I prefer Blithildis Princess of Soissons (not Sessions) dau of Clothaire I to have been Ausbert's wife, as I cannot believe that he married her and then, presumably on her death, married Blithildis Princess of Paris. Ausbert died c570. See http://www.geneal.net/2222.htm



This/these woman/women is/are definitely a sticking point in my advancement beyond Arnold on the distaff side, but make fascinating reading nevertheless, however infuriating it is!!



There has to be a definitive answer accepted by experts and historians, but it does not jump out at you as obvious, when you Google any of these names!!



Best wishes

Mark