Thread: Were they living in sin? CANNOT find Marriage Entry

I've looked high and low, I've not been in bed until almost 2am 2 nights running and don't know where to look next! It's sending me INSANE!! What would you suggest please, I should do next? I've found the couple on the 1891 and 1901 census but not on marriage index. They are:



Francis Hancock b. 1865, Fen Ditton, Cambridge.

Helen/Orpha Batstone b.c. 1860 Chard, Somerset.



She was Helen in the 1891 census and Orpha in the 1901, and I'm pretty certain it's the same person.



Anyone help please - before I slit me wrists??



M

x

Hi Morgana.



A lot of people in the 19th century (& I am sure, earlier) didn't get married for several reason: 1) it wasn't important; 2) it cost money (the church charged then as they do now) & unless they were rich, they couldn't afford it. My great-grandparents had 2 children before they married. As for the name change: sometimes the enumerator was given the correct name, other time a diminutive or nick-name! You may also notice that in the censuses, people didn't age as they do now. Some of my ancestors only aged 7 or 8 years in a span of 20or 30 years. How'd they do that??



Hope this helps.

Regards,

Beryl

Hi



Do you have other records for these 2 other than the census info you mention?



I have found this which might explain why sometimes she is Ellen/ Helen and sometimes Orpha.



England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index: 1837-1983

Birth, Marriage & Death

Name: Ellen Orpha Batstone

Birth: Sep 1857 - Chard, Devon, Dorset, Somerset



Also in 1861 there is

1861 England Census

Name: Orpha Batstone

Birth: abt 1857 - Chard, Somerset, England

Residence: 1861 - Chard, Chard, Somerset, England





I can't find Francis' birth so maybe he had another name too.



Also it is possible that between living with ther family that she got married to someone else first and so would have used her married name to get married to Francis.



Or that they didn't get married because one of them was already married!



Best



Jo

Francis birth reg:



Dec 1865 Vol 3b Page 460

Chesterton Cambridgeshire





Strange thing is...I cant find any of the childrens birth registrations either I was going to suggest purchasing one of the birth certificates as this would clarify mums name......i'm sure she wouldnt have been able to use the Hancock surname on official certs...unnless she was married or changed name by deed poll ( was that available then?!?)



Do you have any idea when she died? What name was she registered under?



Maybe they married "late on" in life......or it would mean a trawl through all the Marriage Indexes from c1883/4...as it could have been mistranscribed



Good Luck with your search





Loz

Well i had a ancestors born out of wed lock they used their mums surname on marriage cert' and fathers christian name were father was put , instead of blank

Hi Morgana,



You probably have these but they might help others to help you.



Ellen BatstoneAge:13 Estimated Birth Year:abt 1858 Relation:Sister-in-law Gender:FemaleWhere born:Chard, Somerset, EnglandCivil Parish:Chard Town:Old Chard County/Island:Somerset Country:England Street address:



Occupation:



Condition as to marriage:



Disability:



View Image

Registration district:ChardSub-registration district:ChardED, institution, or vessel:3Neighbors:View others on page Household schedule number:150Household Members:NameAgeEllen Batstone13 Selena Batstone18 Ada Lee6 Eva Lee5 Mary Lee9 Ruth Lee1 Sevena Lee31 William Lee30

1881



Orpha E. BalstoneAge:23 Estimated Birth Year:abt 1858 Relation:Servant Gender:FemaleWhere born:Chard, Somerset, EnglandCivil Parish:Preston County/Island:Sussex Country:England Street address:49 Shaftsbury RoadEducation:



Employment status:



View Image

Occupationomestic ServtRegistration district:Steyning Sub-registration district:Shoreham ED, institution, or vessel:27 Neighbors:View others on page Household Members:NameAgeOrpha E. Balstone23 Adelaide M. Harrington1 Clara Harrington39 Daisy C. Harrington Mabel F. Harrington7 William Harrington43



The image does look like Balstone though but there isn't a birth of an Orpha Balstone around that time.

Maybe..........you already have this.



Name: Ellen Orpha Batstone Year of Registration: 1857 Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep District: Chard County: Devon, Dorset, Somerset Volume: 5c Page: 471 (click to see others on page)

Francis juniors birth?



Name: Francis John Hancock Year of Registration: 1884 Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep District: Pancras (1837-1901) County: London, Middlesex Volume: 1b Page: 69 (click to see others on page

A VERY good morning to you Slizzy Starlight & Chris. I'm VERY sorry I haven't been on this board since last week - my brains suddenly turned to mush! Got 'The Call' last Friday morning - I have been for the first time elevated to the status of GRANDMA-DOM!! Everything else put on back burner - house is a tip!



Anyway, many thanks to you all for these nuggets. I do already have them all, thank you, and I don't know whether you picked up Slizz, that this one -



Francis birth reg:



Dec 1865 Vol 3b Page 460

Chesterton Cambridgeshire



it looks like Francis had a TWIN named HARRY! When I discovered the entry(online, without concrete proof) I rang the registrar for that area, she looked and said it was HIGHLY likely that it was a Twins birth, but without buying both certs (anything for a quick buck ) we wouldn't know for sure.



The links that you've all given me I can't currenrly view 'cos my '2 weeks free trial' with Ancestry.com have expired - I plan to join the .co.uk site on a monthly basis, for various reasons. I should be able to view them then, shouldn't I ?



Thanks for bearing with me on this (odd choice of words, that.... ).



It's the Marriage info that's annoying me - just NOT THERE is it!



M

xxx